From The NAYPIC Log: Elm Guest House

THE NAYPIC LOG

Extract

The following pages are taken from a copy of the Log Book kept by the National Association of Young People in Care (NAYPIC).  The Log covers the period from March-September 1990 and was written by Chris Fay, who at the time was an adviser to NAYPIC.  It was a record of the day-to-day work undertaken by the charity and includes a number of pages relating to Carole Kasir and Elm Guest House.  A transcription of the text is provided under each image for ease of reading, with additional notes.

100_1007_resized

…I was referred to a psychologist by a colleague who worked in a help-line service.  She told me about how boys from Grafton Close (& other homes) were being used in a rent boy ring between 1973-1982.  Many powerful & well known people were said to be involved.  She introduced me to Carol Kasir, who had owned & run a guest house in Barnes, South London until 1982.  In June 1982 her guest house was raided by armed police from the Special Patrol Group, under a warrant issued under the Prevention Terrorism Act, although the police continue to deny this.  However, under the provision of the Act the police are obliged to notify arrested persons in writing that they are being held & denied access to lawyers, etc.  Carol was given such a notice & succeeded in hanging onto it by hiding it under her dentures, after the police searched her to get it back.  They wanted to make it appear she had been arrested in a straightforward ‘vice’ raid.

Now it is true, and not denied by Carol (or) her husband, that she was operating a gay guest house, specialising in gay clientele.  Given the liberalisation of laws concerning homosexuality, she was doing nothing illegal in operating a gay guest house.  It was only after the raid and her trial that Carol realised what had really been going on & how both she and her guest house had been used as a cover for other activities.

Notes

The psychologist referred to is Adelaine Stolper.

The warrants for the arrest of Haroon and Carole Kasir were issued from Bow Street Magistrates Court.

An arrest under the Prevention of Terrorism Act 1974 meant that Harry and Carole, as suspected terrorists, could be detained on the police’s own authority and held without legal representation for up to 48 hours.  We understand that Carole’s solicitor confirmed in late March 1990 that Carole had been held for 24 hours and denied access to him under the Prevention of Terrorism Act.  She was then held for a further 12 hours and interviewed again with her solicitor present, Carole said it was her third interview whilst in custody.

100_1008_resized

When we first met her, it was in relation to helping her & her children with their case against Richmond Social Services and the police, for wrongfully taking her children into care, falsifying evidence and the damage suffered by the children as a result of all this.

I saw & spoke to Carol many times in the next 18 months.  Her experiences had made her distrustful & wary of people, but eventually she did come to trust myself, Mary & NAYPIC & that we had no ulterior motives.

The idea to turn the guest-house into a gay guest house came from a regular at the house, called Barry Haddon.  He frequently stayed there with another man called Terry Dwyer.  Unknown to Carol at that time but Haddon was a pimp & pornographer specialising in providing young boys for sex and pornography.  Dwyer was a small time pornographer & police informer, as well as being a paedophile.  Both Dwyer & Haddon were involved in supplying boys, many from care, to a variety clients, including a number of MPs, local councillors & other important figures.

One of Haddon’s clients was Harvey Proctor MP who frequently visited (& occasionally stayed) at the guest house.  He was one of a number of MPs that Haddon brought to the guest house & to whom he was supplying boys.  Haddon & Dwyer were later convicted for their part in supplying boys to Harvey Proctor.  I have spoken to a number of the boys used by Haddon, some of whom were as young as 8 years old at the time.  Dwyer supplied a number of young boys, recruited locally on the poor run down estates in Battersea, such as the Patmore Estate & the Doddington.  Haddon supplied boys & used them to make porn videos from care, many in the care of Richmond, particularly from Grafton Close.

Notes

We understand that Carole’s son was taken into the care of the London Borough of Richmond-upon-Thames and placed in Grafton Close Children’s Home.  Her daughter was at a private boarding school and it was decided by social services that she should remain there.

Advertisements

41 Comments

Filed under Abuse, Fernbridge, News, Politics

41 responses to “From The NAYPIC Log: Elm Guest House

  1. Pingback: From The NAYPIC Log » Alternative News Network

  2. Bishop Brightly

    “Haddon & Dwyer were later convicted for their part in supplying boys to Harvey Proctor.”

    Were they?

    • Mark

      Good question. May the website authors can provided a link to the court case?

      “We understand that Carole’s solicitor confirmed in late March 1990”

      Understand from whom, no name of solicitor provided?

      “She introduced me to Carol Kasir, who had owned & run a guest house in Barnes…”

      Yet neither Carol Kasir or her husband noticed young boys being taken in and out of their small guest house?

      “When we first met her, it was in relation to helping her & her children with their case against Richmond Social Services and the police..”

      When was she first met 1982, 1988 are there contemporay notes?

      • I am not the author.

        These are taken directly from the NAYPIC Log book and represent the understanding at that time of NAYPIC staff dealing directly with Carole Kasir.

      • Mark

        “…taken directly from the NAYPIC Log book”
        That has been independently verified by whom? How would one know an official NAYPIC Log book from a forgery? How many staff did NAYPIC have?

        Why are the notes written like a novel or tabloid feature with so little detail, such as the age of the child taken into care, when taken into care, how long in care for?

        A woman runs in her home what some may think is a knocking shop, and she doesn’t notice children being taking in or out? Could she be covering her tracks and taking revenge on Richnond social services for removing her child?

        What steps have the website owners taken to check if Dwyer & Haddon were tried and convicted of supplying children to an MP?

      • chris46

        Mark. I hate having to state the bleeding obvious but:
        The “log” was an administerative device for recording events. They are handwritten(mine). There is no “truth/fasehood” they merely record what was said. Also from a legal stand point they are “extraneous notes” made at the time. For evidential purposes they carry the same legal weight as a policemans notebook. They were NEVER meant for public consumption but were internal working docs. In what universe do you think I, gojam or anyone else would put up victims names in public? I have given ALL information to the old bill – AGAIN. If they hav’nt knicked all the adjectives and nouns perhaps I should launch “Operation Wishfull Thinking”!!

      • Mark

        @chris46
        I am assume you are Chris Fay, please read also my response to kaztgray regarding issues with your notes.

        If as you say the ‘log’ is merely record of what was said don’t you need to indicate who said what, rather than leave it to the reader’s imagination. There appears to be no indication of what you’ve been told and what is your opinion.

        Your notes indicate Haddon & Dwyer ferried young children from various parts of London in particular a South West London care home to the guest house to be sexually abused by paedophiles who had high profiles and were powerful.

        From your notes Carole Kasir is said to have been naive, but she and her husband must have been deaf, dumb and blind not to notice young children being delivered to their home to be sexually abused by their paying guests.

        Carole was naive but during the chaos and shock of having armed police bursting into her home she had the wit to think ahead to fold and place under her dentures the arrest papers.

        Are Carole’s actions those of someone naive?

        If young children were being sexually abused at the property isn’t it extremely likely she, her husband, Haddon & Dwyer would be heavily suspected of operating a paedophile ring and be investigated.

        The notes don’t state when Carole was first spoken to, only that you talked to her at some point for over 18 months but your ‘log’ only covers 6 months and is written as if looking back.

        Your notes state, “Haddon & Dwyer were later convicted for their part in supplying boys to Harvey Proctor.” would you have a trial date and venue or a newspaper report of that time?

        Did Haddon at anytime mention Proctor’s long term lover?

      • chris46

        Mark are you deliberately acting thick or what? People know my agenda, so whats yours? Just a few points:
        1) Its a log book. Whats opinion got to do with it? Its a record of what we were TOLD, not a report on the outcome of any investigation. Whats your point mate?
        2)Who said anything about Haddon and Dwyer ferrying kids around. Thats NOT what the log says, perhaps you know different – evidence please!
        3)Again were in the log does it say carol hid anything at the guest house? She hid the “notice to detained persons” under the OSA after 36 hours at the police station, because the police wanted it back to cover up that the raid had been carried out under PTA not vice as police maintain. That is what she TOLD us – read the log mate!
        All these criticisms seem very familar, they were exactly the rubbish that was being put out by police and security services in 1990. Any connection mate?

      • Mark

        Tell me if this is wrong, from your latest response all the information you wrote down that is in the pictures came from Carole Kasir but the additional NOTES are from the author of this blog. That you just noted down what she said and did not investigate or verify what she told you. Correct?

        One of the things she told you was that, “Haddon & Dwyer were later convicted for their part in supplying boys to Harvey Proctor” a simple search throws up numerous sites that quote your notes and present Carol’s statement as fact without any supporting evidence. The first comment on this page asks if Haddon & Dwyer were convicted of supplying boys to Proctor, so I’m not the only one who’s queried the matter.

        I accept Haddon & Dwyer supplied rather than ferried young children to clients.

        I still have a problem with ‘naive’ Carol who was blissfully unaware she was regularly making rooms available to paedophiles, but let’s put that to one side for now.

        Here were a husband and wife operating a small guest house (4 or 5 bedrooms?), it’s usual to book as a couple or a single person. From what I’ve read and lists I’ve seen, some men merely ‘visited’ and did not stay overnight so what did Carol & her husband think was going on ? For example if they have a single man who booked in regularly and each time a different ‘visitor’ turned up did they not suspect their rooms were being used for more than board & lodging?

        Maybe Carole and her husband Haroon had an extremely liberal attitude as to how their rooms were used?

        Having looked at the property I can’t see how Carol & Haroon would not have known someone was entering or leaving, which leads me to question how any paedophile activity that may have taken place went unnoticed.

        However naive Carole was she had the wit in custody to fold and hide an arrest paper under her tongue.

        Would not Carol & Haroon have been at the top of a list of suspects along with Haddon & Dwyer, and is it any wonder the children were taken into care? Paedophiles appear to be extremely manipulative and deceitful people, should a child be left with a mother who was possibly associated with such people?

    • Terry dwyer aka Terry allen was cleared by the home office and relased I met him in 1988 the worst thing that ever happened! I have alot of information of Terry dwyer up to the year 2000

  3. Matt

    That scumbag Harvey Proctor – had backing from MPs on a failing business. I hate these MPs and won’t rest until justice is done. I don’t care if it brings this country to its knees. Look after our children.

    • …and that’s why Theresa May doesn’t want the police to inform the press when people are arrested- though confusingly Cameron thought it just might, maybe, possibly, be a tad too totalitarian to deny the public what is in their interest. Bets are being hedged…Political knickers twisted much?

      • Len

        What needs to happen for her announcement to not allow names to be released without a guilty verdict to become reality? Can ACPO just act upon it or is new legislation required?

    • This country needs to be brought to its knees and every paedophile outed .Sadly it won’t happen though.

    • Mark

      The first shop opened in 1987, if it was failing a second shop would not have opened. The shops remained trading for 5 – 6 years, not bad for a new venture. You make it sound like a crime that a shop closed.

      If websites like this reported the full facts you’d know the full circumstances of Proctors arrest. A newspaper paid for a story, how did they know who talk to? Did the newspaper reporter know the prostitutes before they went to Proctor’s flat?

      Neither prostitute complained to the police, so the case was brought about by the newspaper. If it had been two female prostitutes there would have been no charge, just a juicy Sunday scandal.

      • chris46

        Mark, for your information. Proctor was onne of Haddons clients and had been for years. If you like I will send you a copy of Haddons diary from years before Procters arrest, whilst Haddon was still in care. In it he lists all his clients, including Harvey Procter. Also Procter stayed at EGH were Haddon was a rentboy. BTB the police knew of this relationship years before Procters arrest, need I say more!

      • Hey Chris,

        Maybe we should post Haddons diary up here?

        I’m sure Mark and his friends would be delighted to see it…

      • kaztgray

        are u a complete imbecile mark? for starters, it tells u at opening of piece, they are day to day journal-type records from 1990. so id guess she was introduced some time around fkin 1990.
        they are written the way they are because it is probably the best way to record the events of a day, especially if it is to be read similar to a narrative to build a complete picture of the situation.
        notes were kept on kids same as notes were kept on every other person – so a complete picture could be established, and any disappearing from the picture could be queried.
        as for not seeing anything, there is no possible way for a person, or a person and their spouse to cover a desk in a guest house 24-7.

        now stop being a very stupid troll and find something else to do.

      • Mark

        @kaztgray

        “it tells u at opening of piece, they are day to day journal-type records from 1990. so id guess she was introduced some time around fkin 1990.
        they are written the way they are because it is probably the best way to record the events of a day.”

        Please read it again, It says for the period Mar – Sep 1990 it’s written in the form of looking back not as a day to day journal, if it were I’d expect some dates?

        It does not say when Carole Kasir was first spoken to…

        “When we first met her, it was in relation to helping her & her children with their case against Richmond Social Services and the police…”

        That could be any time from 1982 to 1990. Further on the author writes…

        “I saw and spoke to Carol many times in the next 18 months……”

        March to September 1990 is only 6 -7 months, which could mean Carole Kasir was first met in the autumn of 1988, but as no dates are given it is left to our imagination to decide when meetings took place.

        More vagueness, “We understand that Carole’s solicitor confirmed in late March 1990 that Carole had been held for 24 hours”, understand from whom, Carole her husband, something read on the internet?

        Under Notes: “We understand that Carole’s son was taken into the care…” again, understand from whom?

  4. it would help a lot if chris faye would speak now.

    and john oaks.

  5. murunbuch

    Gojam – can you try to find out who ‘Steve’ was in connection with Elm Guest House? 1982 ads in Capital Gay give ‘Harry’ as contact but otherwise identical ads in 1981 list contact as Steve.

  6. Mark

    http://postimg.org/gallery/7pkkeq9g/

    I found these images of documents said to be of information relating to Elm Guest House. The two names on a document dated 2 Feb 1989 have been obscured one was from NAYPIC the other a local councillor. Not sure why the names are obscured.

    https://theneedleblog.wordpress.com/2013/02/13/david-hamilton-grant/

    According to this very blog the notes were provided by Mary Moss and written by Christopher Faye, former NAYPIC advisor and John Oaks (Oakes) a journalist. Although difficult to read one of documents dated 13 Aug 1990 refers to a John wanting to write a story for The Mail On Sunday. It would seem John Oakes was a Lib Dem councillor in Haringey from 2006 to 2010.

    The images are difficult to read and it’s not clear what some of the notes relate to, also it’s not clear if Carole Kasir was the source of all the information pictured.

    Various information can be gleaned from the images. It was said there were photos & images of prominent people at Elm Guest House, have any surfaced?

    Image 43 states a regular at Elm Guest House was a Company Director who was into kids and had kiddie porn, Carole kicked him out when she found out. When the police raided the house on 19 June 1982 it is stated booked in were two male prostitutes, a rent boy and three men in one room.

    A newspaper reported the Guest House had a reputation and a passing local resident had seen a group of naked men in the front room of the property.

    The rooms in the guest house don’t seem to be massive and with 3 men booked in the same room, a rent boy and two male prostitutes also booked into the guest house on the same night, I can’t accept Carole Kasir was naive and had no notion of what might be happening at her guest house.

    No wonder her 10 year old son was placed in care.

  7. Steven

    Hi Chris I will not use my real name on here but please call me Steven first of all I would like to thank You and NAYPIC for your investigation into the abuse of Adolescents at Langton House in which I read all the stories about Langton House.
    I was in Langton House between 1984-1987 in which I was systematically abused by staff on a daily basis in which I was left with no where and no one to turn to.
    I reported the abuse to AMI Healthcare whom owned Langton in which they failed numerous times to write back to me.
    I later found that all my letters were being intercepted by staff and were read in which I spent 35 days in the time out room being sedated and endured violent assaults on my person just for writing letters of complaint.
    You stated that the gardens should be dug up as some residents may of been killed off.
    Residents were disappearing all the time in which when staff were asked we were just told they had ran away.
    Like you said you never hear from any victims from Langton House so this must be the first.
    The abuse that we received went alot deeper then anyone can imagine.
    I was forced to stand outside in just my boxer shorts in mid winter while staff drank hot coffees etc while I shivered with the cold.
    I was forced to join in barbaric Gym sessions in which I along with others were stamped on punched kicked to the ground by staff.
    It was always the weak residents whom endured this punishment because we could not stand up for ourselves.
    I dreaded Gym and swimming as I had almost drowned because I had a member of staff standing on my back forcing me to the bottom of the swimming pool.
    Female residents were humiliated and abused violently and sexually.
    The points system was not fit for purpose and still I can hear (YOU FAILED YOUR POINTS) ringing through my ears.
    The member of staff whom carried out this barbaric treatment I will name as PH was the main instigator of the abuse.
    I have never been given the chance to talk to anyone about what happened to me and others with the fear that I would not be believed.
    The abusers have never been brought to justice and just closing Langton House down is never enough.
    We are forced to live our lives knowing that they are still out there perhaps still abusing others out there with only the hope that they will be found out before some dies.
    These people belong in prison and do not deserve to work with people and clearly need to be caught.
    It is clear that the abuse was covered up keeping it from the public domain but I read on website that all residents were classed by the people in Swanage and Langton Matravers mentally deranged Adolescents which in fact is not true.
    We were in there because Langton was a dumping ground for local authorities but we are as normal as anyone else.
    I would like to tell you what really went on at Langton but this is not the place to do it as their maybe staff from Langton reading what I have put so could you give me the chance to tell what really happened.
    Thank you Chris for all your hard work exposing the high levels of child abuse not just in Langton but else where to.
    Its a dam shame NAYPIC no longer exsists as they were a credit to this country and a great support to all victims of abuse within the care system.
    May I suggest that the same as NAYPIC should be set up to expose further abuse to protect other children and adults in private homes and hospitals with the view that one day child abuse will be a thing of the past.
    If you are on facebook then I can pass on my details to you in your in box.
    Again many thanks

    .
    .

  8. Steven

    Hi Thank you for your reply how do I get in touch with you.
    As stated before Steven is not my real name I also dont want to leave my number on this blog

  9. Steven

    Thank you I will be in contact shortly

  10. What is Chris Fay’s background and what is/was NAYPIC, who set it up? It is described above as a charity but does not seem to be listed as either a registered or a removed charity by the charities regulator (http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/find-charities/). How did contact between Carole and NAYPIC/Chris come about?

    The former owner of the guesthouse was arrested in July:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/third-arrest-in-child-sex-abuse-inquiry-8698455.html

  11. This is my first insight of elm guest house etc I know several of the people listed and I am shocked to discover Terry dwyer and others were involved in this kind of thing I have accurate details an knowledge of Terry also his other name and addresses I need to make this known who should I contact to shed further light and information ?

  12. Have you got any more information about terry dwyer who lived on the patmore est please I met this man in the eighties and I believe terry went to prison with haddon have you any information regarding this?? Thank you

  13. Pingback: Elm Guest House: Vigil, September 15th, 2014, and Links to Newspaper Reports | Desiring Progress

  14. Pingback: MYSTERIOUS ZAC GOLDSMITH | Alternative News Network